JUANA SUMMERS, HOST:
Peace talks in Geneva to end Russia's war in Ukraine wrapped up today. We don't know yet what is in the latest document, but the heavily pro-Russian draft plan drawn up by Russia and the U.S. has likely been amended after Ukraine and its European allies weighed in. We go now to NPR's Eleanor Beardsley, who's been watching this from Ukraine's capital of Kyiv. Hi.
ELEANOR BEARDSLEY, BYLINE: Good evening.
SUMMERS: Eleanor, just start by reminding us what was in this plan that was so objectionable to Kyiv and to the Europeans.
BEARDSLEY: Well, Ukraine would have had to limit the size of its army, but not Russia. Ukraine would have to give up territory with cities full of Ukrainians in the east that it's been fighting and defending these last four years while Russia has been unable to take them. Ukraine would be banned from ever joining NATO, whereas Russia would have sanctions lifted and joined the G8. The draft plan crossed every one of Ukraine's and Europe's red lines, such as nothing about Ukraine without Ukraine. And the plan was drafted behind Ukraine's back. So European allies were very shocked by it, but they scrambled to come together in a united front in Geneva. German Chancellor Friedrich Merz told President Trump the entire European continent was at stake in the negotiations, and Polish Prime Minister Donald Tusk said Russia cannot impose its conditions on the continent.
SUMMERS: Any sense of when we'll know what's in this new plan? And is any agreement going to meet President Trump's deadline of Thanksgiving?
BEARDSLEY: Well, President Volodymyr Zelenskyy said he'd be meeting with his negotiating team when they return to Kyiv tonight, but we don't really know. We got a glimpse, though, of how things might have changed when a member of the Ukrainian team wrote on Facebook a couple hours ago. He said the 28-point plan in the form in which everyone saw it no longer exists. And he said not a single remark of the Ukrainian side went unheeded and that the final decision on the most problematic issues will be made by the presidents. He didn't say which presidents, but there are rumors in Ukrainian media that Zelenskyy could be headed to Washington to meet Trump.
SUMMERS: There's a big corruption scandal involving some of Zelenskyy's closest advisers - though not him, we'll note. Did that affect Zelenskyy or Ukraine's position in these negotiations?
BEARDSLEY: Well, of course, it makes Zelenskyy and therefore Ukraine more vulnerable. You know, corruption matters to Ukrainians. It's something from their Soviet common past with Russia, and Ukrainians want to root it out. They really see their future in Europe, which requires strong rule of law before you can join. So corruption is a big deal, but Juana, Russia is a bigger deal. So the scandal is on the back burner right now. Today, I went to an outdoor vegetable market to get some produce, and I spoke to two women about everything going on, and they had totally opposite views on the war. One thought Russia would never stop coming and that Ukraine was doomed, and the other thought Ukraine would prevail. But they both trusted Zelenskyy. They said he had empowered Ukraine and rallied the world to their side. Have a listen to Kyiv businesswoman Ruslana Ponklif, who was the optimist.
RUSLANA PONKLIF: I just trust in my country, in president of this country and in these people who lives in this country, who stay in this country. It's a very strong power, really - people who not afraid, who believe in this country and who be very strong.
BEARDSLEY: So Ukraine does seem to be in a stronger position after these Geneva talks. And Russia has already besmirched what it is calling the European plan, which replaces its 28-point plan. It says it doesn't work for Russia. And tomorrow, the Europeans will hold a meeting about the coalition of the willing, and that's the European peacekeeping force that would enter Ukraine when there is a peace deal. And Russia is very much against European peacekeepers in Ukraine.
SUMMERS: NPR's Eleanor Beardsley, thanks as always.
BEARDSLEY: You're welcome, Juana. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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