STEVE INSKEEP, HOST:
Senator Amy Klobuchar represents Minnesota and is also seeking the Democratic nomination for governor there, and she is on the line. Senator, welcome back.
AMY KLOBUCHAR: Well, thanks, Steve. Great to be on.
INSKEEP: Governor Walz there spoke of economic ruin for people in Minnesota, and he said the government has to, quote, "fix what they broke." The idea there, I think, is that the federal government damaged people's lives and they should pay. Should they?
KLOBUCHAR: Yes. Let's start out with the loved ones of Alex Pretti and Renee Good. There are ongoing investigations - one state, one combined federal-state - for these outrageous killings of two innocent American citizens. Those cases are ongoing, and we need the feds to allow complete access to investigatory evidence to the state Bureau of Criminal Apprehension. That's the first thing and most obvious.
Secondly, there has been so much money spent on this. That $75 billion that they put into ICE that tripled their budget that made them bigger than the FBI was spent on this invasion. You look at what it was every week. One estimate is $18 million American taxpayers were paying every week, 9 million on compensation for border control and ICE, 4.5 million for the lodging. So all of that is a question of values. Is that how you want to spend your money, American taxpayers? My answer is no.
And then there is the economic costs and the cost of the overtime for the police, not just in Minneapolis, in suburban police departments, rural police departments. So obviously, we will and they will be seeking compensation for all the overtime, all the extra time. And then, of course, there will be civil lawsuits about the violations of rights of people being racially profiled. Among elders, door rammed in, thrown into a car in his underwear, driven around for an hour only for them to find out, oh, we got the wrong guy. He's perfectly innocent. The man we are trying to get has been in prison for years.
INSKEEP: So you're telling me that lawsuits are likely here.
KLOBUCHAR: Certainly.
INSKEEP: OK. I want to ask about another aspect of this. People sometimes have been talking of preserving evidence so that people who violated the rights of citizens can be prosecuted in a future administration. You were a prosecutor in Minneapolis. Can you talk me through that scenario? What would it require to preserve evidence and prepare for prosecutions three years from now?
KLOBUCHAR: Well, a lot of this will have to do, of course, about what the cases are about and statute of limitations, things like this. But the feds...
INSKEEP: Let's say the shootings of the two U.S. citizens.
KLOBUCHAR: OK. The feds can't destroy that evidence. A federal judge in Minnesota appointed by Donald Trump issued a ruling that they could not destroy that evidence. So you will have evidence that should be there, and then you have the state Bureau of Criminal Apprehension simply wanting access to that evidence because, in the case of Renee Good, they are actually doing a parallel investigation with the attorney general of Minnesota and the county attorney to look at that because that investigation, if you remember, got closed down by the feds. So they are seeking that evidence right now.
INSKEEP: So you believe it would be possible to prosecute people three years from now?
KLOBUCHAR: Yes, depending on statute of limitations. But I believe they're going to be doing it sooner than that on a state basis, and possibly on a federal basis in the case of the Alex Pretti case. And then there's also going to be civil lawsuits.
INSKEEP: OK. You think that there might actually be a good-faith investigation on the federal side?
KLOBUCHAR: There has to be a good-faith investigation.
INSKEEP: We should note, also, we are on the verge of a DHS shutdown, a Homeland Security shutdown, and it is over this dispute over new rules for immigration agents. It doesn't sound like you and the Senate got very close at all to an agreement on this.
KLOBUCHAR: Well, this was expected. Most of the government, the vast majority of the government is funded because we had an agreement. The one part that isn't, Homeland Security. Our belief is ICE should be separated from TSA. Those parts should be funded. We should have a separate vote on that, a negotiation on ICE with much needed reform and, in my mind, a reduction in all the funding they got. It was completely out of hand. They have too much money. That's a lot of this. But they need training. They need requirements on body cameras. They need to have to follow police conduct rules. They need to follow the Fourth Amendment on search and seizure, have judicial warrants. The list is endless because this was basically a roving gang of ill-trained officers.
INSKEEP: And...
KLOBUCHAR: And it has to stop. But Minnesotans stood together, stared down ICE, never blinked. And that is why today - we have now learned from the announcement yesterday that ICE is leaving Minnesota.
INSKEEP: OK. Democratic Senator Amy Klobuchar of Minnesota, who's also a candidate for governor there. Thanks very much for your time, as always.
KLOBUCHAR: Thanks, Steve. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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